Muay Thai vs. Savate
Quick answer
Savate is a French boxing of the 19th century that combined kicks with the shoe with the punches of English boxing, Muay Thai is a Thai full-contact fighting art. Muay Thai kicks with the shin and also fights with elbows, knees and in the clinch, savate kicks with a precisely designated part of the shoe and competes in technical assaut without force and in full-contact combat. The Muay Thai federation IFMA has had full IOC recognition since 2021, neither is Olympic.
At a glance
| Muay Thai | Savate | |
|---|---|---|
| Country of origin | Thailand | France |
| Origin | 20th century (present form) | 19th century (present form) |
| Founder | – | Joseph Charlemont (codifier)Charles Lecour (codifier) |
| Contact | Full contact | Light contact · Full contact (depending on style) |
| Sparring | Full contact | Light contact · Full contact (depending on style) |
| Competition format | Full contact | Mixed |
| Olympic status | Not Olympic | Not Olympic |
| Ranks | No | Yes (glove colours) |
| Rank recognition | fragmented | by federation |
| Attire | Shorts and guards | Protective gear |
| Weapons | No weapons | Weapons optional |
| Forms | No forms | No forms |
| Relative cost | medium | medium |
| Techniques in the encyclopedia | 14 | 5 |
Scales 1–5
Rated for the typical training of an adult beginner in an ordinary club, calibrated across all arts.
What each art is built from
Editorial rating 0–3: how much room each area gets in ordinary training.
History and relationship
Savate is French boxing that in the 19th century combined the kicks of street savate and the Marseille chausson with the punches of English boxing. Muay Thai received codified rules in Thailand in the twenties and thirties of the 20th century and reached France, together with kickboxing, via the Netherlands.
- Roots of savate: Parisian street savate with low kicks and the Marseille chausson with high kicks, sources place them in the 17th or 18th century.
- 1825: Michel Casseux opens an establishment for a regulated form without headbutts and grappling.
- 1845: Charles Lecour, after encountering English boxing, opens the first school of French boxing and the cane in Paris with his brother Hubert.
- 1877: Joseph Charlemont’s Traité de la Boxe Française codifies the punches and stances.
- 1925–1935: under King Rama VII, Muay Thai gains referees, rounds and gloves.
- FISav is founded in 1985, and in 1993 IFMA holds the first World Championships in Muay Thai.
Technique
- Eight limbs: fists, elbows, knees and shins.
- Elbows, knees, punches and kicks score to the head, trunk and legs (IFMA).
- The clinch is allowed, and the referee breaks it with the command yaek.
- Prohibited (IFMA): strikes to the groin, to the ankle, to the back of the head, intentional headbutts.
- Four kicks (fouetté, chassé, revers, coup de pied bas) and four punches.
- Kicks are delivered with a designated part of the shoe, for example the chassé with the heel (FF Savate).
- Kicks to the head, trunk and legs, punches to the head and trunk alone. Prohibited: groin, nape, back, crown, and for men punches below the waist.
- The rules do not list elbows, knees and the clinch among the permitted strikes, and holding and pushing are penalised.
Muay Thai strikes with the shin and continues at close range with elbows, knees and the clinch. Savate specifies precisely which part of the shoe is used to kick and keeps the fight at the distance of kicks and punches.
Training
| Muay Thai | Savate | |
|---|---|---|
| Basis | running, shadow boxing, skipping rope, pads, medicine ball | kicks with the shoe, punches, assaut without force |
| Rounds | 3–5 minutes with a 1–2 minute break | we have not been able to document the structure of a lesson |
| Beginners | not documented | FF Savate: in initiation the instructor may adjust the space, duration and intensity |
| Other content | the wai khru ram muay ritual | canne de combat is often part of the training |
Muay Thai builds training around pads and rounds with a short break. For savate we have found neither the structure of a lesson nor its frequency, and the rules show technical combat without force and the cane. We have not found the ratio of technique to sparring for either of them.
Progression and ranks
| Muay Thai | Savate (FF Savate) | |
|---|---|---|
| Grades | there are no uniform ones, some schools use the pra jiad on the arm | gants bleu, vert, rouge, blanc, jaune, then argent technique 1°–3° |
| Children | not documented | kangourou 1°–3° for pré-poussins and poussins |
| Milestone | the trainer hands over the mongkhon headband | assaut from gant rouge with the trainer’s consent, combat from gant jaune and gant de bronze |
| Outside France | – | the requirement for the competition glove differs by country |
In France savate has a system of coloured gloves that directly conditions entry into competition, first into assaut, then into combat. Muay Thai has no uniform system of grades, and readiness for a fight is traditionally judged by the trainer.
Physical load and risks
- Strotmeyer et al. 2016 (195 fighters): injury in the last fight in 55.4%.
- Limbs 58%, head and neck 30.6%, concussion in 5.4% of fighters.
- Sieńko-Awierianów et al. 2016 (40 practitioners): injury in training in 55%.
- We have not found an injury study in savate with numbers.
- The 1999 review by A. Monroche is available only as an abstract without numbers.
Who it suits
| Muay Thai (IFMA) | Savate (FF Savate) | |
|---|---|---|
| Lowest competition category | 10–11 years | pré-poussins 7–9 years |
| Adults | seniors 17–40 years, U23 18–23 years | juniors 18–20, seniors from 21 years |
| Veterans | we have not found a category, seniors end at 40 years | vétérans from 35 or 40 years, in combat with special medical consent |
| Women | the same weights and rules as men, chest protector | assaut only between the same sex, for women kicks to the chest and punches to the chest and punches below the waist are prohibited |
Children
| Muay Thai | Savate | |
|---|---|---|
| Competition from | IFMA 10 years, the Thai law of 1999 states over 15 years | FF Savate from 7 years, FISav youth World Championships in assaut alone |
| Grades for children | not documented | kangourou 1°–3° |
| Prohibited | we have not found special technique bans for children in the IFMA rules | we have not found children’s rules on strikes to the head |
| Protection | trunk protector for youth, helmet, shin and elbow guards | we have not found children’s rules on protective gear |
| Length of a fight | 3 × 1 to 3 × 2 minutes depending on age | we have not found it |
| Studies on children | abstract (333 child boxers, 200 controls): lower IQ, declining with the years of boxing | we have not found one |
| Positions of physicians | Ramathibodi hospital: no contact up to 10 years, no strikes to the head up to 15 years | we have not found one |
Self-defence
- Sparring and the clinch against a partner’s resistance.
- Fists, elbows, knees and kicks, including at close range.
- Modern Muay Thai does not develop ground fighting and weapons.
- Combat against full resistance at the distance of kicks and punches.
- The competition rules contain neither the clinch nor the ground.
- Savate défense: defence against a grip and a strike with a partner simulating an attack.
- The cane in the discipline canne de combat.
Muay Thai additionally covers the clinch, elbows and knees, while savate has a separate defence discipline with grips and the cane. We have not found a study of transfer into real self-defence for either of them.
Practical use
| Muay Thai | Savate | |
|---|---|---|
| Programmes for adults | IFMA lists fitness classes for every level | FF Savate: savate forme, savate défense, sport pour tous |
| Health programmes | we have not found any | four sport-santé certifications (CNOSF 2019), among others for seniors and after spinal cord injury, without hard impacts, on medical prescription |
| Fitness studies | we have not been able to document any | we have not found any |
| Older age | 30 seniors aged 60–70, Muay Thai dance: improved mobility and strength after eight weeks | we have not found a study |
In France savate has federal health programmes, while Muay Thai has one small study with an adapted dance in seniors. No general conclusion about suitability can be drawn from this.
Competition
| Muay Thai | Savate | |
|---|---|---|
| Formats | one full-contact fight | assaut (technique and precision without force) and combat (effectiveness as well) |
| Fight | IFMA 3 × 3 minutes, Lumpinee at most 5 × 3 minutes | FF Savate 3–7 rounds of 1:30 or 2:00, Élite A combat 5 × 2 minutes |
| World Championships | IFMA since 1993 | FISav: seniors assaut, combat and canne de combat, youth assaut alone |
| Recognition | IFMA fully recognised by the IOC since 2021 | FISU 2008, a demonstration at the 1924 Olympics, we have not found IOC recognition |
In savate one advances to combat through assaut, according to the gloves. Neither is Olympic.
Gear and costs
| Muay Thai | Savate | |
|---|---|---|
| Footwear | bare feet | shoes compulsory |
| Clothing | shorts and a T-shirt (IFMA) | intégrale or a vest |
| Gloves | IFMA 10 ounces | boxing gloves |
| Protective gear | shin and elbow guards, helmet, groin guard, mouthguard | mouthguard, hand wraps, helmet for juniors |
| Relative cost | medium | medium |
Availability and organisations
| Muay Thai | Savate | |
|---|---|---|
| International organisation | IFMA, WMC for professionals (with IFMA since 2019) | FISav (since 1985, a member of AIMS) |
| National example | – | FF Savate: savate boxe française, canne de combat and bâton, savate forme, savate défense |
| Grades when moving abroad | there are no uniform ones | the requirement for the competition glove differs by country, we have not found mutual recognition |
Switching and combining
- Kicks to the legs and head and punches carry over.
- Retrain shin kicks into kicks with a designated part of the shoe.
- Unlearn elbows, knees and the clinch.
- Add assaut, in which technique without force is scored.
- Kicks, punches and movement at distance carry over.
- Learn to kick with the shin and the bare foot.
- Learn the clinch, elbows and knees, and how to cover against them.
On the left is the move from Muay Thai to savate, on the right the opposite direction. The Thai student Chanita Taphussadin moved in Bangkok from Muay Thai to savate and described the difference as combinations chained faster. Anissa Meksen holds titles in savate and in Muay Thai (WPMF, WBC). We have not found joint competitions of the two disciplines.
Philosophy
- Wai khru ram muay: respect for the teacher, parents and ancestors.
- Three bows to the Buddha, the dhamma and the sangha.
- The mongkhon headband as a tribute to the gym.
- FISav lists ethics, aesthetics, education and effectiveness as values.
- To these are added fair play, discipline and respect for the rules and for people.
- We have not found a religious or ceremonial framework of savate.
Training culture
- The mongkhon as a tribute to the gym, pra jiad bands on the arm.
- 17 March is Muay Thai Day.
- At Rajadamnern betting with hand signals is legal.
- The term boxe française was used by Théophile Gautier in 1840 (FF Savate).
- Lecour’s school was attended by Eugène Sue, Théophile Gautier and Alexandre Dumas.
- The federation also brings together the cane canne de combat and the bâton.
Common misconceptions
- Researchers regard the legend of Nai Khanom Tom from 1767 as more mythological than historical.
- Muay Thai and kickboxing spread to Europe at the same time via the Netherlands and were therefore long confused, but they are different disciplines.
Which to choose
Frequently asked questions
Does savate kick with the shin as Muay Thai does?
No. The FF Savate rules define the striking surfaces of the shoe, for example the fouetté with the toe or the instep and the chassé with the heel.
Are elbows and knees allowed in savate?
The rules do not list them among the permitted strikes, and holding and pushing are penalised. We have not found an explicit ban in the rules.
Is savate full contact?
It depends on the format. Assaut scores technique and precision without force, combat scores effectiveness and fighting spirit as well.
Did savate fighters also compete in MMA?
Yes. Gerard Gordeau, heavyweight world champion in savate (sources give 1991 or 1992), lost in the final of UFC 1. Cheick Kongo also competed in MMA.